Key reloads

[McClellan]

Why not make it so you have to press certain keys in order when you reload your rifle, so you're more active and not just waiting, and if you mess up a key, you'll drop the percussion cap, or the minie ball will fall off the muzzle, etc, and ultimately making you have to drill and practice. Maybe servers could turn this off and on, too. This could also convert over to your multiple reloads system based on experience, and the keys could either be different, or easier based on your experience.

[Bravescot]

As cool as that would be I'd much rather just sit back and let it reload. Mashing keys would get confusing and a line of Veterans could destroy a line of green players. I think it should stay the way it is but the chance of misfiring increases the more you fire your rifle.

[McClellan]

and a line of Veterans could destroy a line of green players.

Exactly why its a good idea.

[Bravescot]

Exactly why its a good idea.

Why it's a terrible idea.

[Hairywarhero]

Why it's a terrible idea.

Init thats such a terrible idea :/

[Bravescot]

I am sorry for saying it's such a bad idea but think of the amount of people that would rage quit because of it. The shooting needs to be balanced and fair and I'm sure the Devs are trying their hardest to make it so.

[spe801]

In theory that would be a cool idea, and very historically correct. Those guys botched their reloads all the time, especially early in the war. But I don't think many would go for it.

[McClellan]

Just an idea

[Rithal]

Just an idea

While it would be cool and historically accurate, it could get on the nerves of some of the more "casual" gamers who are new to the game. I really don't like the idea of key reloads necessarily. I'm personally in favor of just faster reloading speeds based on your character's experience. Notice I said character.

In reality its not a terrible idea, and its not like it hasn't been discussed before, so everyone ease up just a tad ;)

[Zahari]

Character experience ? What do you mean exactly ?

[Rithal]

Character experience ? What do you mean exactly ?

When I say character experience, I mean it like it is in 99.9% of all other fps games. You make a character when you first start playing for either Union or Confederacy. He starts out with 0 experience so he has normal reload times, normal accuracy,ect. If he is fighting for the Union, maybe he can be restricted to a generic union uniform without a whole lot of customizations available at first. As you fight with this character, he ( or she... don't want to be sexist ;) ) gains more experience that slightly increases accuracy, reload time, maybe stamina, maybe melee skill ect. I'm not really sure at this point. Its just an idea, and it would be great if something similar to this will be in the game.

[Soulfly]

When I say character experience, I mean it like it is in 99.9% of all other fps games. You make a character when you first start playing for either Union or Confederacy. He starts out with 0 experience so he has normal reload times, normal accuracy,ect. If he is fighting for the Union, maybe he can be restricted to a generic union uniform without a whole lot of customizations available at first. As you fight with this character, he ( or she... don't want to be sexist ;) ) gains more experience that slightly increases accuracy, reload time, maybe stamina, maybe melee skill ect. I'm not really sure at this point. Its just an idea, and it would be great if something similar to this will be in the game.

Sounds like the system of RedOrchestra 2, but i am against it. Giving experienced players even more advantage over new ones makes no sense.

[Rithal]

Sounds like the system of RedOrchestra 2, but i am against it. Giving experienced players even more advantage over new ones makes no sense.

Well, it simulates the actual advantage that experienced soldiers had over green troops. I'm not saying give someone who has played 10 hours a 250% aiming buff. I'm saying give very very slight advantages to people who have played longer. It makes perfect sense. You will hardly even know the difference. Maybe make it less likely for misfires to occur for more experienced players. I'm saying things like that.

[Bravescot]

I like the idea of very slight buffs for hardened vets. They would have been better skilled, simple.

[Soulfly]

Well, it simulates the actual advantage that experienced soldiers had over green troops. I'm not saying give someone who has played 10 hours a 250% aiming buff. I'm saying give very very slight advantages to people who have played longer. It makes perfect sense. You will hardly even know the difference. Maybe make it less likely for misfires to occur for more experienced players. I'm saying things like that.

Yet again, of course it makes sense according to reality. But since we are talking about a gameplay feature it simply doesnt, even a slight advantage is unfair compared to green recruits and if the advantage is so minimal that you cant hardly know the difference than its already not necessary to implement. I know what you would like to see, but such a feature will bring up the danger that every player will focus on his KD ratio or character level....just like in each and every other game, like Battlefield or Call of Duty. Those games are a perfect example for that.

[Rithal]

Yet again, of course it makes sense according to reality. But since we are talking about a gameplay feature it simply doesnt, even a slight advantage is unfair compared to green recruits and if the advantage is so minimal that you cant hardly know the difference than its already not necessary to implement. I know what you would like to see, but such a feature will bring up the danger that every player will focus on his KD ratio or character level....just like in each and every other game, like Battlefield or Call of Duty. Those games are a perfect example for that.

I don't think character experience and leveling should be a focus, but I would like to see it in the game. It's simply a fact that veteran troops were better at what they did than recruits, and the game mechanics should simulate that.

[Zahari]

I don't think character experience and leveling should be a focus, but I would like to see it in the game. It's simply a fact that veteran troops were better at what they did than recruits, and the game mechanics should simulate that.
If you will be really veteran of this game you will aim better with out boosts, because you will know how.

[Bravescot]

Leveling shouldn't exist full stop. Soulfly you're getting too hung up on the idea that the buffs and boots go hand in hand with a leveling system. It should be on time. Time spent in a single regiment, time played in battles (stops people from booting up then letting time tick) and other such factors. You leave your reg you loose you buff and go back to square 1.

[Rithal]

Leveling shouldn't exist full stop. Soulfly you're getting too hung up on the idea that the buffs and boots go hand in hand with a leveling system. It should be on time. Time spent in a single regiment, time played in battles (stops people from booting up then letting time tick) and other such factors. You leave your reg you loose you buff and go back to square 1.

Maybe. That's not really how I was seeing it. This entire discussion really depends on how the core game mechanics will work, and until then its really hard to tell how experience will best be applied in game. Shall we postpone this until we know more about the situation? :D

[Soulfly]

Maybe. That's not really how I was seeing it. This entire discussion really depends on how the core game mechanics will work, and until then its really hard to tell how experience will best be applied in game. Shall we postpone this until we know more about the situation? :D

Well after the first shots have been fired there will indeed some better discussion happen, so i think its a good idea waiting for it. Until then, don't cross your bridges before you come to them.

[Bravescot]

*takes step onto bridge* I'll do! I swear I'll do it!

[Zahari]

Don't do it !!! There will be early access this year !!!

[Machoman44441]

How about making it an optional setting for those who want maximum historical accuracy.

[Pvt.Scott]

That idea sounds like u want to make this game into a mini game game which every mini game game sucks and is not good.
If it was in the final game it would be like "RELOADING. *messes up mini game as there's a charge going on* AHHHHH STUPID F****** MINI GAME" *dies* (keeping it clean)

[Szotu]

Greates idea ever.

[Simon445]

Good idea, but too much stuff to do, lets keep it simple as possible.

[Rithal]

Depends on how the devs would go about it. Maybe make it a server option? Makes sure that guys with more "skill" will be able to get more shots off than new guys who are still learning the ropes. I don't know. Just toying with the idea.

[Josy_Wales]

Like the idea of having it optional. Iv said it before, but the more things you can get better at, the longer things stay interesting. Accuracy, strategy, discipline, teamwork and maybe reloading, are things that could make a big difference on the field.

[William]

Exactly why its a good idea.

Same here so ist a skillfull game and veterans are more worth it then new Players in reallife a new recrute is not the same then a Veteran

i doesn´t Need to be like samashing the keybord but somethign like that hmmm...why not

[Jeremiah O'Brien]

How about a full size electronic musket to plug into your computer..

[Rithal]

How about a full size electronic musket to plug into your computer..

XD Lel. If they made it, I would buy it XD However, I feel like you would be at a slight disadvantage to those using only a mouse and keyboard :PPPPP

[Pvt.Scott]

lol. *Mom comes in while playing* Mom: "What are you doing with a real life sized musket" You:"Playing a game"

[Zoranny]

XD Lel. If they made it, I would buy it XD However, I feel like you would be at a slight disadvantage to those using only a mouse and keyboard :PPPPP
Tony hawk got a skateboard and guitar hero a guitar, so why no musket? :D

[Rithal]

Tony hawk got a skateboard and guitar hero a guitar, so why no musket? :D

I don't know.... It just seems a little.... much XD

[rebeldestroyer]

I actually think key reloads are a good idea because instead of morale, reload speed, running speed buffs you would actually feel pressure when being charged and you would mess up on the keys and reload slower. I'm not saying there should be an overly complex sequence like agklwfshhslwfneo. It should instead be something like pressing the r key to start the reload and then arrow keys for steps then maybe mash a button to ram the minie ball/ball into the bore of the gun faster etc...

[Rithal]

I actually think key reloads are a good idea because instead of morale, reload speed, running speed buffs you would actually feel pressure when being charged and you would mess up on the keys and reload slower. I'm not saying there should be an overly complex sequence like agklwfshhslwfneo. It should instead be something like pressing the r key to start the reload and then arrow keys for steps then maybe mash a button to ram the minie ball/ball into the bore of the gun faster etc...

I agree. If there is a system like this, I would like for the keys to be pressed to somewhat apply to the action taking place rather than being a random sequence of keys popping up on the screen. :)

[rebeldestroyer]

yes we have established it. now we wait for one of the devs

[Ol Stonewall Jackson]

I personally think this is a bad idea.

[rebeldestroyer]

i understand why you don't like but its worth a try. you cant know if something is good or bad if you don't try it.

[Skipper]

I Like this idea and also liked the experience system in Red Orchestra 2 because that's how a trained veteran would act. But also slight changes in the skill would be the most to do like ... Accuracy with musket is 60% for a recruit (i am just using some numbers) and for a veteran it gets an additional 5 % or something like that. Also I think there should be Hard Skills and Soft Skills like Hard Skills are independent from the Regiment or troop you are in and Soft Skills are changing when you are leaving a Regiment or troop. Hard Skills could be Stamina, Strength, Which rifles you can use in the Regiment and Soft Skills would be Reloading, Accuracy and Precision because these only develop fully in a trained veteran Regiment. What do you Guys think?

Greetings Skipper

[Rithal]

Sounds interesting. :)

[Soulfly]

I think we already had this discussion. I am against advantages for a certain groups of players, it is unfair for new players fighting against experienced ones, especially if those get better "stats" from the game itself like better gun stability or sth. like that....

[Hinkel]

I think we already had this discussion. I am against advantages for a certain groups of players, it is unfair for new players fighting against experienced ones, especially if those get better "stats" from the game itself like better gun stability or sth. like that....

This is my own opinion now, no official statement:

Since War of Rights is an authentic game, it would be realistic to have veteran, trained and green regiments ingame.
You think, fresh recruits complained, that they had to fight against veteran regiments? If the commander sent them against those veterans, it was bad luck ;)

If the game tries to simulate an authentic civil war game, why shouldn't there be veterans and new soldiers, like it was in 1862? New players will learn the game and gain skill, even against more expierenced players. So for myself, I would be totally for such a system, cause its authentic and historical! :)

[Soulfly]

This is my own opinion now, no official statement:

Since War of Rights is an authentic game, it would be realistic to have veteran, trained and green regiments ingame.
You think, fresh recruits complained, that they had to fight against veteran regiments? If the commander sent them against those veterans, it was bad luck ;)

If the game tries to simulate an authentic civil war game, why shouldn't there be veterans and new soldiers, like it was in 1862? New players will learn the game and gain skill, even against more expierenced players. So for myself, I would be totally for such a system, cause its authentic and historical! :)

Actually its more painful fighting WITH them ;) what i tried to express was, is that i am against benefiting players. If you look at today's triple A titles you always see Level 1 players running around with axes and level 100 players with MG42s + all sorts of perks an so on.

Regarding gameplay and balance this does not make any sense, i know you guys want it as realistic as possible but the fact that players which already have experience get even more advantages bothers me...you dont force a player to uninstall the game after he has faced his virtual death, because that would be realistic too

[Skipper]

Well ... You've got your Point Soulfly but I think It's the Dev's part to take care of these Skill-"Gaps" so there would be a green beginner with an Axe and a veteran with a Double Axe. You see what I mean? Just small perks ... only small things to accomplish for the veteran because see it that way: what if every veteran stays with the same weapons, same gear, same skills and same attitude for over 200 hours of playing without getting more than maybe Steamachievments?

Wouldn't that be boring too?

Komm schon deutscher Kamerad :D Ich versteh dich schon kleiner David gegen großen Overpowerten Goliath aber ... wäre es andersrum nicht langweilig?

Greetings Skipper

[Ol Stonewall Jackson]

Its not like we killed a few billy yanks and then got a damn new rifle or they killed a few johnny rebs and got a new coat from supply for doing a good job. We didn't have that luxury and to imply it in the game would be kind of ridiculous. If we went with this system then a lot of the confederate troops should start at a veteran status for having already been involved in the Mexican American war.

[Rithal]

Actually its more painful fighting WITH them ;) what i tried to express was, is that i am against benefiting players. If you look at today's triple A titles you always see Level 1 players running around with axes and level 100 players with MG42s + all sorts of perks an so on.

Regarding gameplay and balance this does not make any sense, i know you guys want it as realistic as possible but the fact that players which already have experience get even more advantages bothers me...you dont force a player to uninstall the game after he has faced his virtual death, because that would be realistic too

Well considering there was little difference in weapons at the time (Lets be honest. They were all basically the same thing made by different companies XD) I doubt players who have been playing for longer would have an insane advantage over new players. I think they mean more goes into their stats rather new weapons being "unlocked".

[rebeldestroyer]

plus the accuracy stat should not get better ( maybe sharpshooters) because since we are mostly talking about muskets and primitive revolvers the actual soldier has very little control of were the ball/bullet goes.

[Rithal]

plus the accuracy stat should not get better ( maybe sharpshooters) because since we are mostly talking about muskets and primitive revolvers the actual soldier has very little control of were the ball/bullet goes.

The weapons they used were actually "rifled" muskets. I'm not gonna go in depth but basically, soldiers actually had considerable control over where the bullet hit. So, I would say if they went the route of adjusting some stats depending on level or rank or what have you, the accuracy stat in my opinion would be the primary difference between a green soldier and a veteran soldier. It might be trumped only by reload speed. :)

[MilitantMonkey]

I think stating it as "accuracy" makes it seem like this is a "weapon" stat.. I would instead say that veteran soldiers would have less of a "sway"/steadier hands. Which is true, since they were more used to the stress of battle than the fresher soldiers. Of course no matter how much experience you have, everyone was still nervous about going to battle.

[rebeldestroyer]

I think stating it as "accuracy" makes it seem like this is a "weapon" stat.. I would instead say that veteran soldiers would have less of a "sway"/steadier hands. Which is true, since they were more used to the stress of battle than the fresher soldiers. Of course no matter how much experience you have, everyone was still nervous about going to battle.
Yes, that is a good suggestion.

[Soulfly]

Well considering there was little difference in weapons at the time (Lets be honest. They were all basically the same thing made by different companies XD) I doubt players who have been playing for longer would have an insane advantage over new players. I think they mean more goes into their stats rather new weapons being "unlocked".

That was an example of games these days, i can remember playing FPS games without any character progression or unlocks or whatever....it was the gameplay itself which was motivation enough, but we will see how this turns out

[SHoGUN]

The key reloading is a really good idea, that would really add a new element to musket games. The solution would be to make it not ridiculously hard, but cause the player to be a little focused is all. It shouldn't add (much) speed, but take it away if there are any fails. Think about it.. reloading for a new soldier would be a bit of a fumble, but they would soon get the hang of it.

Reloading effectively was crucial with muskets, so why miss that feature out in the game? Just imagine the encounters that this could produce.. standoffs that involve two players frantically trying to reload before the other; players that crack under pressure of taking out that last soldier charging towards you with their bayonet.. and it would generate some really funny moments too. Training would pay off as it would in real life, and veterans would have an earned advantage new players. I really don't think this would be a put-off to these new players at all though, so long as it's not overly complicated.

As mentioned from the devs, there would be buffs your player would receive by staying with you team mates. I'd say an obvious one would be gun sway. But perhaps being able to reload with speed could be slightly tougher too. Using the key reloading could give the option of making it more challenging, and much easier to fumble a reload. Going lone wolf, or being last alive would naturally make anyone more nervous compared to being beside brothers-in-arms. Nerves could easily effect sway, and could also easily effect getting the rammer inside the barrel, especially in the heat of battle. So that could be a nice group buff that would discourage anyone going off on their own. (It would work more as an anti-buff than a buff, but same thing essentially.)

Side note: For those people recommending an overall rank-up buff (even a slight one) be applied to a player just because of the hours they have played is an ineffective way of separating 'vets' from new players. It's easy to do which is why so many games do it, but is so so tacky, and creates this grind element rather than learning process. You should have to earn skill, not just have it gifted automatically over time. And with this games focus being on realism, I believe 'levelling up' is a step in the wrong direction, as is an automatic balance of skill sets. Experienced players would have an advantage by becoming better at reloading through skill. Some vets would be better than others, which is how it should be. None of this lazy 'level up' to reload quicker and aim better nonsense. Earn it.

[R21]

+1

I was going to suggest what the OP suggested myself. I think one main advantage from such a system would be it would deter lone-wolfing, or at the very least make people who decided to do so be even more picky with their shots (like running off somewhere else to reload).

I'd also be up for making it a server option (like a hardcore mode) but the problem with this is it may divide players or be a feature that never gets used. If you look at RO2 as an example it has Hardcore/Realistic/Casual modes and pretty much from release it has had servers mostly playing Realism mode (The other Game-Modes and game-types basically never get played) so I personally would like to see key reloading as a standard feature as it'd make Players adapt to it. If you try to appease everyone, like with RO2, you just wind up with a bunch of modes that divide the community and go un-played.

http://store.steampowered.com/app/353690/

In Dust you have different keys assigned to different Weapon operation (like remove/insert Magazine, cycle bolt etc) and you could have a similar system in WOR (Button to load the Musket with shot/button for Ram-rod/Button for placing percussion Cap) which would all be independent actions that could be done in the wrong order (like Players accidentally loading more than one load and speeding up the fouling process)

http://store.steampowered.com/app/234190/


RO2 also has a rank system that's very similar to whats been mentioned in this thread (Lower level players suffer way more suppression/more sway/less accuracy/longer reload times) and i'd prefer to see a more organic version of this i.e. reload times proficiency based on player input rather than stats that slowly increase the more XP you gain. I've seen people saying that it'd be unfair to less experienced Players due to more experienced Regiments being able to reload faster, any kind of XP system you implement that increased stats would achieve the same result (As Happens in RO2).


The way i'd envisage such a system would be:

keys for Operations like mentioned above

Bonuses for tapping key at correct time (speeds Animation up slightly)

I think letting Players fail the reload process might be a bit annoying so if a player doesn't press a key at the correct time they just don't get the slight speed boost they would've, but I would like to see Players being able to put multiple loads into Guns and suffer the consequences (Like a Double load being really inaccurate and speeding up fouling of the Gun).

[Challis89]

If I may add my tuppence worth I don't think button reloading is a good idea it's not bad but might put off the more casual gamer as has been mentioned. I liked the idea of the more battles you fight you get a very very slight advantage in speed adds to the realism also means people will stick about for longer. What I would like to see as part of that is the more battles you fight the option to add deeper powder burns etc to the face which adds to the veterans status.

[R21]

I'm hoping they give the idea a chance during the testing Phase (Maybe have one server with this option enabled).

And on the subject of Reloading, how will this work with Cannons? In Mount and Blade Napoleon there are Artillerymen classes with Ram-Rods for cannons, Shells have to be placed in Cannons them rammed down. Although this is kind of cool it looks terrible in-Game, i'm hoping there'll be steps in loading cannons in WOR but with better looking and more precise Animations (Like your character locking on to the end of the Barrel when placing Ammo and using a Ram-rod so they actually match up with the location of the barrel).

[SHoGUN]

+1

I'd also be up for making it a server option (like a hardcore mode) but the problem with this is it may divide players or be a feature that never gets used. If you look at RO2 as an example it has Hardcore/Realistic/Casual modes and pretty much from release it has had servers mostly playing Realism mode (The other Game-Modes and game-types basically never get played) so I personally would like to see key reloading as a standard feature as it'd make Players adapt to it. If you try to appease everyone, like with RO2, you just wind up with a bunch of modes that divide the community and go un-played.


Yeah I agree with this. Even the word 'hardcore' puts off a lot of casual gamers, whereas if key reloading was just the standard, all types of players would get to use the feature. I'd say they would enjoy the reloading process more than if it were just automated, and no dividing of players would happen.


RO2 also has a rank system that's very similar to whats been mentioned in this thread (Lower level players suffer way more suppression/more sway/less accuracy/longer reload times) and i'd prefer to see a more organic version of this i.e. reload times proficiency based on player input rather than stats that slowly increase the more XP you gain. I've seen people saying that it'd be unfair to less experienced Players due to more experienced Regiments being able to reload faster, any kind of XP system you implement that increased stats would achieve the same result (As Happens in RO2).

Again, agree 100%. I think veteran players will in general, out-perform new players, especially if there were small additions like the key reload idea. This enables players to prove their rank rather than have it gifted automatically. I like what Challis89 mentioned about cosmetic changes to veteran players. If there were to be any kind of 'levelling' system in place, it should be purely cosmetic. Perhaps aged uniforms that are ever so slightly dull in colour with more badges (keeping it to a minimum, and historically authentic). This would keep the game feeling realistic, and I think if the game is fun, and still feels rewarding to level up, players won't be put off from a reload process the game has added. Besides, players that don't appreciate realism in games, won't like this game in the first place.



The way i'd envisage such a system would be:

keys for Operations like mentioned above

Bonuses for tapping key at correct time (speeds Animation up slightly)

I think letting Players fail the reload process might be a bit annoying so if a player doesn't press a key at the correct time they just don't get the slight speed boost they would've, but I would like to see Players being able to put multiple loads into Guns and suffer the consequences (Like a Double load being really inaccurate and speeding up fouling of the Gun).


Yes, maybe give a slight speed boost if done correctly and quickly. Although I would personally like to see slight botch-ups from players that don't get the reload right, but not punish them too severely. Not to the point where they have to restart part of the process, but rather, let that part of the process be reloaded in a slightly more amateur way, i.e. an ever so slight fumble on inserting the ball. I like that kind of tension in the heat of battle, and believe this would add some really nice immersion.

[R21]

Yeah I agree with this. Even the word 'hardcore' puts off a lot of casual gamers, whereas if key reloading was just the standard, all types of players would get to use the feature.

Exactly, like i've said this is where RO2 fell down. They had fans of the original RO who expected the Game to be one way but tried to appease as wide an audience as possible with all the different modes. Fans of the original felt let down as the hardcore mode barely got played and wasn't really what they wanted anyway and the 'more casual audience' they tried to cater to basically just didn't exist (The casual mode along with the different modes geared towards this Game-type never get played).

In the long run they would've served themselves and the Playerbase better by having a more focused Game in terms of mechanics and standard server features.

[PvtPalmer11pvi]

+1

I was going to suggest what the OP suggested myself. I think one main advantage from such a system would be it would deter lone-wolfing, or at the very least make people who decided to do so be even more picky with their shots (like running off somewhere else to reload).

I'd also be up for making it a server option (like a hardcore mode) but the problem with this is it may divide players or be a feature that never gets used. If you look at RO2 as an example it has Hardcore/Realistic/Casual modes and pretty much from release it has had servers mostly playing Realism mode (The other Game-Modes and game-types basically never get played) so I personally would like to see key reloading as a standard feature as it'd make Players adapt to it. If you try to appease everyone, like with RO2, you just wind up with a bunch of modes that divide the community and go un-played.

http://store.steampowered.com/app/353690/

In Dust you have different keys assigned to different Weapon operation (like remove/insert Magazine, cycle bolt etc) and you could have a similar system in WOR (Button to load the Musket with shot/button for Ram-rod/Button for placing percussion Cap) which would all be independent actions that could be done in the wrong order (like Players accidentally loading more than one load and speeding up the fouling process)

http://store.steampowered.com/app/234190/


RO2 also has a rank system that's very similar to whats been mentioned in this thread (Lower level players suffer way more suppression/more sway/less accuracy/longer reload times) and i'd prefer to see a more organic version of this i.e. reload times proficiency based on player input rather than stats that slowly increase the more XP you gain. I've seen people saying that it'd be unfair to less experienced Players due to more experienced Regiments being able to reload faster, any kind of XP system you implement that increased stats would achieve the same result (As Happens in RO2).


The way i'd envisage such a system would be:

keys for Operations like mentioned above

Bonuses for tapping key at correct time (speeds Animation up slightly)

I think letting Players fail the reload process might be a bit annoying so if a player doesn't press a key at the correct time they just don't get the slight speed boost they would've, but I would like to see Players being able to put multiple loads into Guns and suffer the consequences (Like a Double load being really inaccurate and speeding up fouling of the Gun).

I think thats a little much..I mean being able to do all 9 steps would be very interesting but it would get boring rather fast (personally I think reloading being a one click deal would suit everyone just fine)...As for failing the reloading process...you must remember that these soldiers were in fact trained and trained well...some even veterans... as for a double load...I'll pass on that as well I don't know of anyone who would even hold and fire a double loaded rifle (such tools were made to take care of this issue rather than firing) maybe veteran players being able to load slightly faster than players under fire would perhaps be a little more sufficient.

[R21]

I meant more along the lines of breaking up the existing animations with Key taps:

Like one key would initiate putting powder and the ball in, the next key the ram-rod, the next key placing the percussion cap and pulling back the Hammer.

Another reason this would be useful is say if you started loading and just when you'd finished putting the Powder and Ball in the Musket the enemy started Bayonet charging you'd be able to move away or counter attack with your bayonet and your Musket would still be partially reloaded. You could then complete the other steps if you got away from the enemy or held off their attack. I get the feeling with the current system even if they do put in the ability to interrupt the Reload process it won't 'save' the progress, like if you got to the same point of loading the powder and ball but stopped the animation there I imagine you'd just have to start the process over again rather than carrying on from that point.

If they segmented the reload animation with button taps not only would it help with a sense of immersion it could wind up being useful in Game-play situations where you need to suddenly stop loading to defend yourself or quickly move away from a position.

https://youtu.be/fUluC6QHS7I?t=46

like 0:47 to 0:52 being the first stage

0:52 to 1:04 being the second

and 1:05 to however long the cap replacing Animation takes


You can kind of see it in action here:

https://youtu.be/fUluC6QHS7I?t=122

When the enemy Soldier is about to get to a guy who's reloading he's still replacing the percussion cap, being able to do it stages means he'd have been able to use the ram-rod then just bring up his rifle for a defensive melee attack.

[PvtPalmer11pvi]

being able to break the reload process I assume will be implemented..if not well just charge them while they're reloading..being able to start reloading were you left off would indeed be amazing. however using a key for every step in the process would get very old and tiring especially for the more casual gamers. I don't doubt that it would be an interesting feature but I just think a one click deal (similar to NW) would be more practical

[Mills]

I like the reload key ideas. Gives players something to learn, practice and increases the skill ceiling slightly so more experienced players do have an earned advantage over new players. Would make the game more competitive.

[Mississippi]

It would be great if you had a option to turn auto reload on or off similar to Red Orchestra 2 / Rising Storm.

[SHoGUN]

being able to break the reload process I assume will be implemented..if not well just charge them while they're reloading..being able to start reloading were you left off would indeed be amazing. however using a key for every step in the process would get very old and tiring especially for the more casual gamers. I don't doubt that it would be an interesting feature but I just think a one click deal (similar to NW) would be more practical

Like both me and R21 have mentioned already, it wouldn't be an overly technical process, nor was the idea intended for every step of the reload. What R21 has mentioned with the youtube clip is perfect. Split it into 3 segments, and just keep the key strokes timed with visual clues of the gun reloading process, not a mini-game screen or anything. Just simple visual clues that are covered in tutorial for you first time playing. If you look at the clip I think adding this will be far more engaging, and makes practical sense too. And if you fail at timing the reload right it could just make the reload happen ever so slightly slower. For example, even if you miss-timed every step of the reload the time difference would only be 2 to 3 seconds difference, and even less if only part of the reload was miss-timed. Doing this in game would be a matter of changing part of the reload animation to a slower version of a slightly less smooth reload.

Before you dismiss the idea as complicated or unnecessary just keep in mind that all the musket fps games so far have been very simple, and not focused on any detail like WoR is doing. This (3) key-stroke reload would make a lot of practical sense for this style, and doesn't at all feel complicated enough to put anyone off it. Also note that if this or something similar was implemented that some other guns in game would have even less attention/steps required for reload, which was part of the bonus of having new ways of reloading, yet the musket would be more fun (for musket lovers.. i.e. everyone here)

[Jeffrey Miller]

Agreed, but the Yankees don't like it and they won the war and are the moderators except Rithal :) so...

How long the character has been in game, how many rounds he has made it through, how many shots he has fired. Those things earn experience.

[Bravescot]

Yes I am a mod. so here is me modding.

1) Please watch the size of your quote, there are spoilers available. You've done it across a couple of threads.
2) Stop double posting

Thank you.

[R21]

Just a thought, but segmented Reloading could solve the problem of un-Reloadable pistols. The Devs said a complete Reload would take too long but if you could just Reload individual Chambers you'd get some use out of your Pistol even after the initial 6 shots (like if it took 12 seconds to reload one Chamber).

[BloodBeag]

Just a thought, but segmented Reloading could solve the problem of un-Reloadable pistols. The Devs said a complete Reload would take too long but if you could just Reload individual Chambers you'd get some use out of your Pistol even after the initial 6 shots (like if it took 12 seconds to reload one Chamber).

It would take much longer to reload just one chamber than 12 seconds and you'd need a table to put it on or to sit on the ground to be able to do it.

[MadWolf]

Why not make is so that you have to different buffs like a achievement you can unlock ?

- Drill Camp Buff:
If your Green you learn how to do stuff. It's a good use of the Drill Camp and a fun way of learning how to play the game.

- VeteranBuff (battle experience):
For the players that have played the game for some time and proud of it for doing so.

[Landree]

The only buffs we should have are part of the battlefield such as standard bearers, musicians, officers, and being in the line.

Character veterancy is completely f'in idiotic. You can have a wonderful game without it! The veterans will already play better than the newbies because they're familiar with the game and have that edge. The RO2 system of better suppression resistance or faster ADS or reloads just makes it completely unfair for the new player or the casual WOR player. It will also change the focus from playing the game as it was intended to a level up gun and run for many certain players who latch onto such features.

Make a damn good game with equal playing fields. Whoever has the best tactics and shots should win the field, not whoever has rank 50.

[David Dire]

Honestly, I think it'd be better for your character to just play an animation instead of any qte's. It would make the player worry more, especially in a large line confrontation, and perform a bit weaker as in real life. A few rare animations (such as dropping a cartridge) could also benefit this.


And getting better stats the more you play sounds like a good idea; not everybody in the civil war at the exact same skills. As long as it isn't too overblown (only about 15-20% stat increase max) it would probably still be viable gameplay-wise. After all, you're mostly going to just be volley-firing muskets with your company. Stat increases wouldnt actually be used too much.

[Landree]

I can not stress enough how much I desire that everyone be on the same playing field in regards to stamina, reload, accuracy, suppression resistance, and otherwise. These buffs should only be afforded as gameplay perks in the battlefield such as being in the line or following your officer's commands. On this I vehemently stand.

I think reloading should just be a key press and it have different stages just in case a reload needs to be broken and continued later on.

[SHoGUN]

Honestly, I think it'd be better for your character to just play an animation instead of any qte's. It would make the player worry more, especially in a large line confrontation, and perform a bit weaker as in real life. A few rare animations (such as dropping a cartridge) could also benefit this.


And getting better stats the more you play sounds like a good idea; not everybody in the civil war at the exact same skills. As long as it isn't too overblown (only about 15-20% stat increase max) it would probably still be viable gameplay-wise. After all, you're mostly going to just be volley-firing muskets with your company. Stat increases wouldnt actually be used too much.
I believe needing to manually reload would amp up player anxiety (in situations) and concentration and therefore create a more engaging experience. Also it'd be the first game to actually utilise the technical process of reloading a musket (if done like described above, and not just make it a tacky mini-game). Otherwise it's a missed opportunity. But worse than doing a simple automated reload would be to add buffs to experienced players. As you just said yourself ^ "Not everyone in the civil war (had) the exact same skills". By adding a buff, you are essentially saying everyone levels up exactly at the same rate. Everyone is just handed their skill on a plate. There is no skill in this, and it doesn't encourage players to even engage in anything. Eventually everyone will level up and everyone will have the same exact set of skills. Buffs like this are tacky and don't encourage player skill in the slightest. Do you really want an unearned buff to be handed to you just because I play more than the next person? Wouldn't you want the skills you have developed to give you that edge over someone less experienced, and prove your veteran status instead.. This is what a reload system like this would do. For me, veteran status would mean an older faded uniform, worn down from battle. Maybe some battle scars on my character and even a badge or two to show my character has been in some battles. Levelling up should unlock cosmetics, not better (unearned) skills.


I can not stress enough how much I desire that everyone be on the same playing field in regards to stamina, reload, accuracy, suppression resistance, and otherwise. These buffs should only be afforded as gameplay perks in the battlefield such as being in the line or following your officer's commands. On this I vehemently stand.

I think reloading should just be a key press and it have different stages just in case a reload needs to be broken and continued later on.+1 I'm glad there are still a lot of others on the same wavelength. I don't understand the desire for 'blanket buffs'. It encourages laziness imo.

[R21]

Also agree with Landree, RO2' experience system is completely unfair and would be so much worse in WOR.

WOR is an even more niche Game than RO2 and you'd just be left with Veteran Players who'd not only know the Game way better but would also have perks giving them a massive advantage over new Players. In a Game like this you do not want to be putting off new Players:

"But it'd be the same with Key reloading, the veterans would still have an advantage!"

Nowhere near as much of an advantage as with an XP/Perk system tied to each Player, it just compounds the issue.

As said by others, the only buffs i'd like to see would be from Officers/Musicians and the like as this is more fair (the team that makes an effort to use these units effectively gets an advantage, as it should be).

[SHoGUN]

Another thing that came to mind with key reloading is you could get a line reloading each step (if broken into 3 segments) all at exactly the same time, even closer in sync than one button reload. With reload taking 17 seconds how could this not be used as an opportunity to bring in some immersion. Otherwise you could just walk off make a quick coffee then come back just in time for your next shot. It doesn't seem earned enough. Not considering the amount of effort it took to reload these guns. This key reload is such a must I reckon. In terms of players that are against it, their seemingly most common argument is it would get tedious. Devs, your job would be to not make it tedious! All those in favour obviously have confidence you'll make it great if you do it ;)

[BloodBeag]

You see, I want the game to be fun. Sooooo I wan't to fire and forget so that firing in lines is actually enjoyable. If you have stats that get better the mroe you play the game, you could just have the percentage chance of dropping a cartridge or misfiring decrease.

[R21]

I think someone else suggested it in this thread, they could add something like manual bolting from RO2 in (like make Key reloading an optional feature for each player).

Those who wanted the benefits of it could switch it on, those that don't like the idea would be able to leave it off but also test it out to see what it's like.

I'd prefer to see this than not have it implemented in the Game at all.

[SHoGUN]

You see, I want the game to be fun. Sooooo I wan't to fire and forget so that firing in lines is actually enjoyable. If you have stats that get better the mroe you play the game, you could just have the percentage chance of dropping a cartridge or misfiring decrease.
So realism isn't fun for you? Would've been nice for a soldier to sit back and take a sip of his coffee while his musket reloaded for him

[Soulfly]

So realism isn't fun for you? Would've been nice for a soldier to sit back and take a sip of his coffee while his musket reloaded for him

actually i am with R21, make it optional. In the end its a game which must be fun to play and such a feature would annoy me after the 3rd reload

[SHoGUN]

Yeah, I'd agree with what R21 said too. If people hate that idea so much, you could have the option to toggle between manual or, automatic with a slightly slower (but consistent) reload time. It wouldn't be added if the devs couldn't make it fun. Next people will be complaining about having to hit R to reload or use the wasd keys as it complicates things, and isn't casual enough. Its purpose is realistic historically accurate shooter. This involves elements that compliment the overall aim. Besides, how would 3 hits of a button during different segments of the reload become so complicated to the casual gamer, or so dull? If done well, it only adds to the game, and doesn't leave empty space (to sip on that tea/whiskey/coffee). Do that when you win the round!

[Bravescot]

You saw through my plan to have mug of tea next to me and sip at it during the reload animation

[Willie Fisterbottom]

You saw through my plan to have mug of tea next to me and sip at it during the reload animation

Sounds like im not the only one who grabs a bite to eat during that reload in m&b

[Bravescot]

Sounds like im not the only one who grabs a bite to eat during that reload in m&b

No need to waste the time doing nothing! ;D might as well grab a snack.

[R21]

You could even just have both implemented at the same time, like pressing and holding R for the first 2 or so seconds will initiate the full uninterrupted Animation but also keep the ability to do the 3 individual steps with other Key presses (like tapping R instead of holding it will initiate the first stage then other keys for the other operations).

For example, the uninterrupted Animation plays normally without any prompts, but each stage of the key Reload has one of these:

https://youtu.be/lD7tKlqGVvE?t=132

Where pressing the key at the right time (in that video when the circular progress indicator intersects with the indicator) will speed the Animation up slightly.

I think with something along those lines you may even get people being converted to the segmented version if you had them both side by side like that in-Game.

The Developers have been very quiet in this thread, wondering if they could comment on stuff like breaking up the animations etc.

[BloodBeag]

I think te idea of it being slightly quicker by doing the button presses but with the chance you do it wrong and that it takes some sort of skill and focus. Also have it as a server option so people could set it to be either or just one war of reloading. Napoleonic wars for mount and blade is a good reload system, left mouse click to reload and then to fire and hold down down to aim.

[Jagdmann]

Somehow I like the idea too, to press multiple keys for reload. Maybe it could be cut shorter, like "only" pressing 3 buttons in line for the needed 9 steps of loading your musket.

[R21]

It's definitely something the developers should look into and potentially Prototype, a 9 page thread shows there's some interest in the idea.

[SHoGUN]

I hope they listen to us here. It's a majority yes, and I think the ones against it would come around if it was implemented properly. And if it does put off a lot of players they could just implement a toggle like suggested. Win/win

[David Dire]

I think a toggle is just the best option righto ff the bat, as it all just comes down to personal preference.

[SemajRednaxela]

I hope they listen to us here. It's a majority yes, and I think the ones against it would come around if it was implemented properly. And if it does put off a lot of players they could just implement a toggle like suggested. Win/win

Yes to this. Toggle would be a simple and effective solution. Maybe the Toggle could offer those who use manual a potentially quicker reload if they really got the timing down over time etc. Just a suggestion.

[Willie Fisterbottom]

Yes to this. Toggle would be a simple and effective solution. Maybe the Toggle could offer those who use manual a potentially quicker reload if they really got the timing down over time etc. Just a suggestion.

Thats basically the same thing as when you have first and third person, sure you have the option to use first person if you prefer it but you'll be at such a disadvantage against people in third person.

[Henry Lloyd]

Have you played Receiver? I played it and it is what you're saying. E to take out magazine, tap E again to drop. Press 2 to take fresh magazine, press Z to insert, press R to rack slide. Hold T then R will do brass check. Press V for safety switch. My god that game is awesome. You must try the game and your idea should be considered.

[SHoGUN]

Have you played Receiver? I played it and it is what you're saying. E to take out magazine, tap E again to drop. Press 2 to take fresh magazine, press Z to insert, press R to rack slide. Hold T then R will do brass check. Press V for safety switch. My god that game is awesome. You must try the game and your idea should be considered.

See that to me sounds too complicated for this game. But something in between this and pushing 1 button would be nice. Especially with added benefit of manually loading it quickly for a slightly faster reload than automatically loading (although I would still prefer manual reload for everyone to start off with, and see how players adjust to it)

[A. P. Hill]

Faster reloads?

It is an established fact that the best reload time you are going to get regardless of how it's done, is 3 shots a minute with a muzzle loader. That of course will change if you are using breach loaders.

[R21]

I wouldn't want to see Receiver levels of Control (It's a cool concept but would just be annoying in a competetive Online Game) but I would like to see whats been mentioned (3 steps activated with individual keys, slight speed buff for tapping key at correct time during said stages).

[Edvard]

Seems like a nice idea because it would be quite realistic. But I think it might be game breaking at some point when veterans are just slaughtering all the rookies. On the other hand if you are playing in a regiment/company you would actually train that in training camp with your company so it would be cool.

[Henry Lloyd]

Somewhere in the middle. Press R to reload mode, Press 1 to take out catridge, tear it and put it in the barrel. Press 2 to take the ram rod and keep pressing T to ram, Press 3 to put back rod and put new percussion cap. Something like this I suppose.